Transparency will be instituted in defense ministry

Transparency will be instituted in defense ministry

Professionalism and internal reforms of the Indonesian Military
(TNI) have been one of the main topics of discussion in the
country since the downfall of Soeharto in 1998. Newly inducted
Minister of Defense Juwono Sudarsono talked to The Jakarta Post's
Tiarma Siboro and Imanuddin Razak on the issue on Wednesday. The
following is an excerpt of the interview.

Question: Within the first 100 days of the Susilo Bambang
Yudhoyono (SBY) administration, what are the top priority or
crucial agenda that you or the Ministry of Defense has set to
tackle first?

Answer: There are two main points. First, we'll establish a
regulation on the redefinition of authority between the Ministry
of Defense and the TNI Headquarters in accordance with Law No.
34/2004 on defense that was enacted on Oct. 16, 2004. As part of
the agenda, I will have a meeting with the TNI chief, the chiefs
of staff of the three TNI forces and the TNI chief of general
affairs later this afternoon. Second, we'll establish good
governance in the defense ministry by imposing transparency,
accountability and efficiency, especially on the acquisition of
defense equipment by each force.

In connection with military reforms, will there be any shifting
of authority between the defense ministry and TNI Headquarters?

Under the prevailing laws -- the law on defense and the law on
the TNI -- the authority of civilian supremacy was achieved when
SBY was elected president after he was nominated through a
political party, as what the Thais experienced with the election
of Chatichai Choonhavan and the Filipinos with Fidel Ramos some
10 years ago. Under the current presidential system, the
president has direct command of the TNI and the Ministry of
Defense. So, there are two different authorities. In the future,
it is expected that integration of the TNI Headquarters into the
defense ministry could be materialized, depending on the laws on
the TNI and defense. But it should be part and parcel of the
integration of the police into the home ministry.

An embargo has been slapped on Indonesia by the United States
concerning the purchase of military equipment. What is your plan
to restore good military-to-military relations in the future?

I plan to visit the U.S. next year to tell Congress, non-
government organizations and human rights organizations of the
importance of helping Indonesia in defense matters, especially
the Indonesian Army as it has been put under the spotlight due to
excesses in the implementation of the TNI's territorial function
in the past. I will tell them that the Army remains an important
element for democratization in Indonesia as in my opinion,
civilian forces, mainly political parties, are still in a mess. I
will tell our friends in America that on paper, we have achieved
democracy and civilian supremacy, though in practice we admit
there still some civilian weaknesses, mainly on civil governance.
In my opinion, an appropriate territorial role of the Army is
still needed.

What do you mean by appropriate territorial role?

In this case, such a role should be maintained until civilians
are really self-governing and political parties can function as
the pillar of democracy. While observing the internal bickering
in the House of Representatives over leadership posts, there are
thoughts of restoring the TNI faction in the House. A month ago,
Indonesia was praised worldwide for its peaceful elections, but
political parties have gained a bad image in the past two weeks
as they boycott and condemn each other.

What's your opinion on TNI officers being involved in business in
connection with improving TNI's professionalism?

Roughly, we need Rp 46 trillion (US$5.06 billion) per year if we
want to build a decent professional force, but in reality the TNI
only gets Rp 18.21 trillion per year, so forget about achieving
an ideal budget. Regarding military-owned firms, cooperatives and
foundations, such practices have been carried out by the military
forces since the 1950s as the government never provided a large
enough budget for security and defense affairs due to limited
funds. Now, I'd like to rearrange and convert all the military's
foundations, cooperatives and firms into military-owned state
firms as practiced in China, Thailand, India and Pakistan, where
the state budget for the military is supported by lawful funds
obtained from military-owned state firms.

On the TNI leadership, there was an idea of rotating the
leadership among the three forces. What is your opinion?

The law on defense stipulates that "it may be rotated", but it is
not compulsory. It therefore depends on the President to decide
whether to rotate the leadership or not. That was the compromise
agreed upon in the law on defense. But in my opinion, only
someone from the Army, which is politically adapted for the TNI
leadership, would be suitable, unless there is a politically
sensitive Navy or Air Force chief of staff who is capable to do
the job.

What's your opinion about the human rights abuse allegation made
by Amnesty International or Human Rights Watch against the TNI?

Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International are part of "the
industry for mankind", which always look for mistakes or
loopholes in various incidents, not only in Indonesia, but also
in other parts of the world. We acknowledge all the past rights
abuses, but they were not systematic and intentionally carried
out. I will not apologize for the past mistakes when I visit the
U.S. next year, but will tell them that the abuse happened
because the state (Indonesia) abused the troops by sending them
to conflict-prone areas without proper equipment and preparation.
Second, we've prosecuted those responsible for the abuse. The
verdicts are not perfect, but they are the results of prevailing
laws and regulations.

How long will it take for complete reform in the TNI?

It must be done gradually and is expected to be completed 10
years after the 1998 reform movement began. It could be done
faster, but it depends on our civilian friends, mainly the big-
five political parties, to straighten out the system. My military
friends say that they would bow under civilian supremacy only
when civilians are of supreme quality.

About the U.S. war against terror?

All arrests of Indonesian suspects must be carried out by
Indonesian police, upon the initiative of the Indonesian
government, and not that of the U.S. government. And the suspects
should also be tried in Indonesia, not abroad.

Can you tell us the process till you get the Cabinet post?

I received an SMS (short messaging service) from Pak Widodo (now
coordinating minister for political, legal and security affairs
Widodo AS) telling me that I would be offered the post of defense
minister. And I told Pak Widodo that I would agree to become the
defense minister only if he was the coordinating minister. It was
Sept. 15, 2004.