Blame central government for autonomy chaos: Ryaas

Interview with autonomy initiator, Ryaas Rasyid, state minister of administrative reforms.

Question: The autonomy law indicates domination by the central government is being retained as shown by the fact that many chapters are requiring the establishment of directive regulations. What is your opinion?

Answer: Who says the central government remains dominant in the law? It's true that many think that, but on the other hand there are other people who say the regions are being given too much (authority) already. So who's right?

As for the required establishment of directive regulations, that's only because the law was processed in such a short time. We wanted everything to be settled as soon as possible; otherwise many people would have accused the government of working at a snail's pace.

Q: So the law was hastily produced?

A: That's true. But not more so than other decrees, other political rulings. If it hadn't been (produced) speedily, the public would have made an uproar.

Look at how the 1999 general election was carried out. It was so quick, wasn't it? If I had been in the position to carry out the general election in an ideal manner, I would have decided on holding it in 2002. Would you have waited patiently until 2002 to see the elections carried out?

So all of Indonesia is currently in haste. Who is willing to be patient in this era?

Q: If we could turn the clock back, how long should the autonomy bill have been processed before it was issued?

A: Ideally, it would have taken much longer so it could be more detailed. Had we been able to do it like that we would not have needed to establish directive regulations or whatever. If we had been able to do it completely, we would have needed at least two years.

But this is the age of reform, and that length of time would have been considered too slow.

In practice, even the implementation of the autonomy law is considered too slow, given we can only apply it in 2001. Many people have said that this is too late.

Q: What is your assessment of the regions' readiness to implement the autonomy policy?

A: The regions have to be ready. Let's not discuss whether or not they're ready now, because this is a stipulation of the law. If they're not ready, then (the authority involved) can be transferred to the higher level administrations.

If a regency is not ready, then the province can have the authority. If the province is not ready, then it can always return the authority to the central government. The autonomy law says such things don't matter.

Q: But the law says there will be no more hierarchical ties between governors, regents or mayors?

A: That is true 'autonomically', but in administrative matters (the hierarchy) remains. The coordination of regencies and cities remains in the hands of the governors, who are the representatives of the central government in regions.

Q: Some people are worried that autonomy will only create small lords and new waves of corruption in regions. What do you think?

A: That is such stupid rhetoric. Who's going to be small lords or big kings? Do you think there's no legislative councils in the regions? Do you think the NGOs in those regions will be silent in the face of irregularities?

The public is so critical now. Even newspapers can easily blow up scandals involving officials. Those worries are unnecessary. There's really no need for us to use the terms 'lords' or 'kings'. This is a republic, there are no more kings here. Even Abdurrahman, who is President, is not a king, and he can easily reap criticism every day.

There will be no small lords in the regions.

Q: But there are chapters in the autonomy law which give plenty of opportunities for regional officials to, for example, wastefully exploit natural resources...

A: There are no such things as small lords. The law does not give the chance. Besides, who dares commit irregularities at this time? What's not transparent these days? You can know when a regent passes wind.

So again these opinions are stupid rhetoric. Those who say that do not realize that times have changed. Those worries are not necessary, I believe.

Q: What is going to happen to regions with poor natural resources?

A: There'll be subsidies called the general fund allocation. It will be different from dana perimbangan (balance fund), because this will apply to both rich and poor regions. Of course, the amount of subsidies will differ from one region to another depending on a number of factors such as population, the dimensions of the area and the state of their infrastructures. It would be unfair if we divided the subsidies equally.

Justice does not mean equality, but rational portions for all.

Q: Will this mean a conflict of interest between regions?

A: Yes, otherwise, if autonomy was not applied and regions were given a large amount of space to manage their resources, would they be able to solve their problems? The central government would then have to intervene again, and we know that the central government is already a failure. All centralistic schemes have failed.

Now we are trying to build regional strength. You can't expect perfection at the outset, you have to give it a chance. Mistakes and shortcomings are normal.

In the context of autonomy, such shortcomings have to be accepted for Indonesia, a country where not all of its people are well-educated. And this is not their fault, but the fault of the government for failing to give its people good education.

What's clear is that the autonomy policy will depend very much on the trust of the regions and people in the government.

Q: We can trust the government to carry out this huge undertaking?

A: I do, ha..ha..ha. I don't know about other ministers. But how can we not trust one another when we are all Indonesians?

Q: Will the poor regions have to depend only on central government subsidies?

A: They should depend on their own creativity. Many breakthroughs can be created, for instance, by lifting some restrictions on investment, to provide free parcels of land and many others.

Q: How about increasing taxes and levies?

A: I wouldn't suggest that because the higher the levies are, the more reluctant investors will be. Investors will think they're committing suicide by entering (regions with high taxation). Nor would I suggest increasing taxes on residents as it would burden them even more.

Q: What will happen when foreign investors venture into regions?

A: Foreign lending can take place only with the approval of the central government. But investment does not require approval.

Q: How will autonomy take place in areas of conflict, such as Aceh, Maluku and Irian Jaya?

A: There's already a special package of autonomy for them. That's not yet stipulated in the law, however. The bill on special autonomy for Aceh, for instance, is still under deliberation.

Q: So they will have a slower version of the autonomy?

A: That may be so, but perhaps that is because we are slow rather than because we're waiting for a better situation (to implement the autonomy there). We're not postponing the drive intentionally, but because the central government has been slow in processing the package.

Q: Do you think this undertaking will succeed and for how long?

A: A lot will depend on how we treat the process. We cannot estimate the length of time it will take before the drive succeeds unless we know the conditions needed to make it a success.

The way I see it, under the current situation, it will take the drive a long time to succeed. This is because the regulations needed as guidelines for implementation are yet to be completed.

Why? Because the central government has been so slow in preparing the guidelines. So any hitch in the drive can be blamed on the central government. If the regions find chaos (while implementing the drive) because they invented their own ruling which did not abide by the regulations, the central government is to blame for failing to provide those references.

So we really need to ask the central government, in this case, the Minister of Home Affairs and Regional Autonomy Surjadi Sudirdja, as he is the one coordinating the drive with other ministers.

Q: Are you saying autonomy will not proceed as planned in January 2001?

A: It will go ahead, but not as smoothly as expected because not all the regulations are in place. On the other hand, some regions have been so creative, producing decrees without consultation with the central government, and their regulations are not always in accordance with those already issued.

But let's not blame the regional administrations, because if they had not taken action, they would have been accused of failing to understand the autonomy drive. This is the heart of the matter: the central government's foot-dragging over the establishment of the regulations. (Pambudi Utomo)